Submissive Discussions

In January of this year I did a post on the different kinds of submissives that I have met online. One of the comments on that post was the left by a submissive man. Since this comment really invited discussion, I wanted to repeat it in a blog post:

Dear Rebel & other Ladies,

Maybe it’s a bit risky to join this ladies’ discussion, me being a (submissive) male, but I’ll venture it. Rebel’s blog about different types of submissives triggered me, because it appealed to a subject I’m thinking of for quite a long time: who is really in charge? If you analyze it until rock bottom: who’s really the boss?

I find it very meaningful that Rebel states that all of the women she mentions are STRONG women. Pro’s in their work, well-articulated in their blogs, smart, kind, tender & respectful. In my opinion that’s the profile of a real leader, a people’s manager, a nice boss. Or, in good American slang, a Mensch.

I certainly am very happy being like that myself (at least: that’s what I hear from my friends) : kind & caring, making sure that my company is happy & satisfied, being a respectful & witty host, and make people feel that they are in charge. But… as it gets to it: I’m the one who sets the rules and I’m sure that I get what I want.

I guess submissiveness is often equaled to weakness, but is that really so? Is the puppeteer steering the puppet, or is the puppet moving the arms of the puppeteer, or is it both happening at the same time? Maybe it’s bullshit what I just wrote and maybe I’m just not experienced enough in bdsm practice, but nevertheless I’m wondering.

I think in reality – and especially in daily bdsm-life – it’s not a one dimensional story. Not: me boss, you slave! But far more a subtle and ever changing play in which the ‘leadership’ switches continuously. Am I making sense or is this total and utterly bullshit?

Kind regards, Kinquie

Slide from Molly’s Myth Busting session at Eroticon 2013 – a word cloud of words describing what submission means to different submissives
(click to enlarge)

In Molly’s Myth Busting session at Eroticon 2013 several myths about submissive women came to discussion. As Molly said, these myths can also apply to submissive males, so for this post I will just speak about submissives. The first myth that was busted was that submissives are weak. We certainly are not. We are strong people that know what we want from life. Many of us are leaders in our professional lives. Some of us run departments or are in high positions in the organizations where we work. Yet, we identify as submissive. Why? Speaking only for myself: I work hard and make several decisions every day. I am always in control and feel that I always have to be. I have been a single parent for many years, which meant that all decisions had to be made by me. Even though I have been and am able to take control in every aspect of my life, I have never been able to set the pace in a sexual relationship. I very rarely take initiative. If I seem to be taking the lead, it’s only because at that moment I am doing what I think the one I am with wants me to do. Believe me, this had gotten me in awkward situations at times!

It is only with Master T that I have dared to say what I desire. With Him I have started to get to know myself, my real wants, needs and desires. We grew to the point where I gave Him control over me and my body. He knows what I want, He knows what I need and He is giving it to me, but He decides in what amounts and when and how. So am I the puppet steering His arms or is He the puppeteer holding the strings and allowing me to dance to His tune, set within my limits? I think that Kinquie has hit the nail on the head – both is happening. There is a dynamic between Dom and sub. The Dom cannot just do what he desires without knowing what the sub’s desires and limits are. This comes down to something that Molly has emphasized in her session at Eroticon: communication. This word came up again in the session that she did together with her husband: BDSM: Tools of the trade. Communication is very important and no Dom should ever play with a sub without them having spoken about either one’s desires and limits. Which means that the submissive definitely has a say in what will happen.

Did Kinquie’s comment make sense to you too? Do you have another opinion or do you have something to add? Please do….

© Rebel’s Notes

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16 thoughts on “Submissive Discussions

  1. Molly’s talk at Eroticon was amazing in busting the myths. I’m with you on this, it is definitely a bit of both. Limits and communication are key, as well as trust.
    I’m still discovering my role 😉

    • I will watch your journey as you discover your role. I feel very comfortable in mine. And you’re right, Molly’s talk was incredible 🙂

      Rebel xox

  2. I have heard and read a lot of debate on this topic. I have rarely ventured and opinion in these waters, but in a recent conversation with my dear sub I think we both had a lightbulb moment. It is a gift offered by the submissive to the Dom but it goes further. The Dom must accept it, and hopefully cherish that gift.
    Is a sub weak? Not in my opinion, I think it takes a much stronger person to be a submissive and allow the will of another to control certain aspects of their life. As you have already stated many sub are powerful people, so why would it be weakness?
    Thanks for a another wonderful post

    • Thank you for your view on this! Indeed, subs are not weak at all. And one thing you are right about too: if a Dom does not accept the gift a sub gives him, no relationship can be built.

  3. I completely agree with Jemima’s analogy of the Tango. I maintain that we are equals who have come together and agreed on a mutual inequality because it makes us both happy but for that to be a healthy, happy productive place for us both then we have to row this ship together, so to speak…. ahhh so many lovely analogies 😉

    Mollyxxx

    • I just love the different ways of expressing the same view – yours, Mina’s, Jemima’s, Honey’s. Like you say, so many lovely analogies 🙂

      Rebel xox

  4. I think it was all said well and echoed my thoughts on the subject. Part of my problem in the past was Bis and Taz not knowing what to do with my submissive nature, thinking me passive; and me not knowing what or how to ask. Sir has shown me both!

    ~Kazi xxx

  5. Honey says:

    Interestingly, I have not spent much time thinking about this. I have spent long periods questioning why I want to submit, why I crave the experiences that I do and why I respond the way that I do. I think that for me, I have a clear understanding about the connection in the relationship. The level of trust, the depth of connection and the communication means that we both lead the relationship forwards. We explore together. He controls the detail, we share the big picture.

    • I love this: … we both lead the relationship forwards. We explore together. He controls the detail, we share the big picture.

      Beautifully said!

  6. Jemima101 really hit the nail on the head. In reality, if you really think about things deeply, the submissive is the one ultimately in charge. It is the submissive who consents to submitting to a dominant/s. It is the submissive who, in theory, has a safe word to end things when it gets to be too much. The submissive, is the deciding factor as to whether or not a dominant can dominate. Sure, on the day to day, the dominant is in charge, and that how we submissives prefer it, but if you look at the bigger picture, we submissives are the key to even letting a whole d/s relationship start in the first place. I suspect this plays a major role to why some Doms insist on doing away with safe words. It takes another element of control away from the submissive.

    • You describe it perfectly. We give the Doms our control, as submissives, wanting them to control us, to push our boundaries, to do things to us we want them to do to us and to which we have agreed. Yet, there’s always the element of surprise and THEIR control because they choose when and what they are going to do to us. I think this is a wonderful dance (to use Jemima101’s analogy) where you don’t know when the leader of the dance – the man – is going to bend you backwards or swirl you around in the air 🙂

  7. The power exchange, the relinqueshing of power, the shifting of power consensually, brilliant to watch and it gives me a lifetime’s worth of material to write about. Doormat submissives? I have yet to meet one, but then again we are attracted to the type of people who mirror ourselves. I like Jemima101 ‘s comment about the tango and without a partner it would not be a dance. I have to agree. And like a tango it should be intense, hot, and a whole lot of fun.

    Rachel x

    • I agree: it should be intense, hot and a whole lot of fun! And I also agree that we are attracted to the type of people who mirror ourselves. Very true!

      Rebel xox

  8. Great myth busting, no DOm I have ever met wants a doormat, and the subs i know are anything but weak! I always find it hard to describe how I give up control but that does not make me in control. The closest I have come to sucessfully managing it for non kink folk (i think) is by comparing it to a tango, the male might lead, but without his partner, and responding to their moves, he would not be dancing.

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